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Probability with n characters
Announcing the arrival of Valued Associate #679: Cesar Manara
Planned maintenance scheduled April 23, 2019 at 23:30 UTC (7:30pm US/Eastern)Separate probabilities from “joint” probabilityProbability Term for something that defies the odds.Probability of Appearance of a character in output.Exponential and Uniform distribution with conditional probabilityShow how the probability that an 8 character password contains exactly 1 OR 2 integers is .630Probability of printing charactersProbabilistic Game TheoryJustin is setting a password on his computer. He is told that his password must contain at least 4 but no more than 6 characters.Selection Probabilitywhat is the probability that a sequence is increasing?
$begingroup$
This is taken from a stochastic processes text.
A printing machine capable of printing any of n characters $a_1, ... , a_n$ is operated by electrical impulses, each character, in theory, being produced by a different impulse. Suppose the machine has probability $p$ of producing the character corresponding to the impulse received, independent of past behavior. If it prints the wrong character, the probabilities that any of the $(n-1)$ other characters will appear are equal.
The question is: Suppose that one of the $n$ impulses is chosen at random and fed into the machine twice, and the character $a_i$ is printed both times. What is the probability that the impulse chosen is the one designed to produce $a_i$?
I thought that the answer can be found by supposing two characters are $a_i$ with probability $p$ and the remaining $(n-2)$ characters are not each with probability $(1-p)$.
I think this would be $$nchoose 2 p^2(1-p)^n-2$$
The actual answer is $$p^2[p^2 + frac(1-p)^2n-1]^-1$$
Looking at this, it seems it might be a conditional probability, but I do not understand what A and B would be in $P(A|B)$.
I also thought that you need to consider at least two characters = $a_i$ as opposed to exactly two, but I do not see how this would lead to the actual answer.
I think there is something about the problem and the question that I do not understand. Please clarify, and please show or give hints as to obtain the actual answer.
probability
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
This is taken from a stochastic processes text.
A printing machine capable of printing any of n characters $a_1, ... , a_n$ is operated by electrical impulses, each character, in theory, being produced by a different impulse. Suppose the machine has probability $p$ of producing the character corresponding to the impulse received, independent of past behavior. If it prints the wrong character, the probabilities that any of the $(n-1)$ other characters will appear are equal.
The question is: Suppose that one of the $n$ impulses is chosen at random and fed into the machine twice, and the character $a_i$ is printed both times. What is the probability that the impulse chosen is the one designed to produce $a_i$?
I thought that the answer can be found by supposing two characters are $a_i$ with probability $p$ and the remaining $(n-2)$ characters are not each with probability $(1-p)$.
I think this would be $$nchoose 2 p^2(1-p)^n-2$$
The actual answer is $$p^2[p^2 + frac(1-p)^2n-1]^-1$$
Looking at this, it seems it might be a conditional probability, but I do not understand what A and B would be in $P(A|B)$.
I also thought that you need to consider at least two characters = $a_i$ as opposed to exactly two, but I do not see how this would lead to the actual answer.
I think there is something about the problem and the question that I do not understand. Please clarify, and please show or give hints as to obtain the actual answer.
probability
$endgroup$
add a comment |
$begingroup$
This is taken from a stochastic processes text.
A printing machine capable of printing any of n characters $a_1, ... , a_n$ is operated by electrical impulses, each character, in theory, being produced by a different impulse. Suppose the machine has probability $p$ of producing the character corresponding to the impulse received, independent of past behavior. If it prints the wrong character, the probabilities that any of the $(n-1)$ other characters will appear are equal.
The question is: Suppose that one of the $n$ impulses is chosen at random and fed into the machine twice, and the character $a_i$ is printed both times. What is the probability that the impulse chosen is the one designed to produce $a_i$?
I thought that the answer can be found by supposing two characters are $a_i$ with probability $p$ and the remaining $(n-2)$ characters are not each with probability $(1-p)$.
I think this would be $$nchoose 2 p^2(1-p)^n-2$$
The actual answer is $$p^2[p^2 + frac(1-p)^2n-1]^-1$$
Looking at this, it seems it might be a conditional probability, but I do not understand what A and B would be in $P(A|B)$.
I also thought that you need to consider at least two characters = $a_i$ as opposed to exactly two, but I do not see how this would lead to the actual answer.
I think there is something about the problem and the question that I do not understand. Please clarify, and please show or give hints as to obtain the actual answer.
probability
$endgroup$
This is taken from a stochastic processes text.
A printing machine capable of printing any of n characters $a_1, ... , a_n$ is operated by electrical impulses, each character, in theory, being produced by a different impulse. Suppose the machine has probability $p$ of producing the character corresponding to the impulse received, independent of past behavior. If it prints the wrong character, the probabilities that any of the $(n-1)$ other characters will appear are equal.
The question is: Suppose that one of the $n$ impulses is chosen at random and fed into the machine twice, and the character $a_i$ is printed both times. What is the probability that the impulse chosen is the one designed to produce $a_i$?
I thought that the answer can be found by supposing two characters are $a_i$ with probability $p$ and the remaining $(n-2)$ characters are not each with probability $(1-p)$.
I think this would be $$nchoose 2 p^2(1-p)^n-2$$
The actual answer is $$p^2[p^2 + frac(1-p)^2n-1]^-1$$
Looking at this, it seems it might be a conditional probability, but I do not understand what A and B would be in $P(A|B)$.
I also thought that you need to consider at least two characters = $a_i$ as opposed to exactly two, but I do not see how this would lead to the actual answer.
I think there is something about the problem and the question that I do not understand. Please clarify, and please show or give hints as to obtain the actual answer.
probability
probability
asked Apr 2 at 17:27
VahanVahan
8910
8910
add a comment |
add a comment |
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
$begingroup$
Let $A$ be the event that impulse $i$ is chosen and $B$ the event that the first and the second printed letter is $a_i$.
Use Bayes theorem to obtain the desired probability.
$$
P(A|B) = fracA)P(A)notA)P(notA)
$$
Now, $P(A) = 1/n, P(B|A) = p^2, P(B|notA)=((1-p)/(n-1))^2, P(notA)=(n-1)/n.$
Substituting in the formula, the result is $p^2/(p^2+(1-p)^2/(n-1)).$
Note that $(1-p)/(n-1)$ is the probability that letter $a_i$ is printed given that impulse other than $i$ is selected.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
In this case is it difficult to find P(A|B) directly using P(AB)/B? Also, I'm unclear on P(B|not A). It seems that P(B intersect not A) would be (1-p)^2 so the result would be (1-p)^2n/(n-1).
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 2 at 21:16
$begingroup$
Try thinking in terms of conditional probabilities as specified in the Bayes formula. These conditionals are simpler to compute as shown above. $P(B|notA) = (1-p)^2/(n-1)^2$ is the probability that letter $a_i$ is printed twice given that impulse other than 𝑖 is selected.
$endgroup$
– dnqxt
Apr 2 at 21:37
$begingroup$
That makes sense intuitively, but I was thinking of $P(B|not A) = P(B not A)/P(not A) = (1-p)^2/((n-1)/n)) = (1-p)^2n/(n-1)$. Why does this approach differ by an extra n?
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 3 at 0:12
$begingroup$
Event $(B|notA)$ consists of two independent events, $(B_1|not A) =$ "$a_i$ is the first letter printed given that impulse $i$ is not selected" and $(B_2|not A)=$ "$a_i$ is the second letter printed given that impulse $i$ is not selected". $Pr(B|not A)=Pr(B_1| not A)Pr(B_2 |not A)$, where $Pr(B_1| not A)=Pr(B_2| not A)= (1-p)/(n-1)$.
$endgroup$
– dnqxt
Apr 3 at 1:23
$begingroup$
Is there any difference in this case between $P(B|not A)$ and $P(B cap not A)$?
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 3 at 19:55
|
show 1 more comment
Your Answer
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$begingroup$
Let $A$ be the event that impulse $i$ is chosen and $B$ the event that the first and the second printed letter is $a_i$.
Use Bayes theorem to obtain the desired probability.
$$
P(A|B) = fracA)P(A)notA)P(notA)
$$
Now, $P(A) = 1/n, P(B|A) = p^2, P(B|notA)=((1-p)/(n-1))^2, P(notA)=(n-1)/n.$
Substituting in the formula, the result is $p^2/(p^2+(1-p)^2/(n-1)).$
Note that $(1-p)/(n-1)$ is the probability that letter $a_i$ is printed given that impulse other than $i$ is selected.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
In this case is it difficult to find P(A|B) directly using P(AB)/B? Also, I'm unclear on P(B|not A). It seems that P(B intersect not A) would be (1-p)^2 so the result would be (1-p)^2n/(n-1).
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 2 at 21:16
$begingroup$
Try thinking in terms of conditional probabilities as specified in the Bayes formula. These conditionals are simpler to compute as shown above. $P(B|notA) = (1-p)^2/(n-1)^2$ is the probability that letter $a_i$ is printed twice given that impulse other than 𝑖 is selected.
$endgroup$
– dnqxt
Apr 2 at 21:37
$begingroup$
That makes sense intuitively, but I was thinking of $P(B|not A) = P(B not A)/P(not A) = (1-p)^2/((n-1)/n)) = (1-p)^2n/(n-1)$. Why does this approach differ by an extra n?
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 3 at 0:12
$begingroup$
Event $(B|notA)$ consists of two independent events, $(B_1|not A) =$ "$a_i$ is the first letter printed given that impulse $i$ is not selected" and $(B_2|not A)=$ "$a_i$ is the second letter printed given that impulse $i$ is not selected". $Pr(B|not A)=Pr(B_1| not A)Pr(B_2 |not A)$, where $Pr(B_1| not A)=Pr(B_2| not A)= (1-p)/(n-1)$.
$endgroup$
– dnqxt
Apr 3 at 1:23
$begingroup$
Is there any difference in this case between $P(B|not A)$ and $P(B cap not A)$?
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 3 at 19:55
|
show 1 more comment
$begingroup$
Let $A$ be the event that impulse $i$ is chosen and $B$ the event that the first and the second printed letter is $a_i$.
Use Bayes theorem to obtain the desired probability.
$$
P(A|B) = fracA)P(A)notA)P(notA)
$$
Now, $P(A) = 1/n, P(B|A) = p^2, P(B|notA)=((1-p)/(n-1))^2, P(notA)=(n-1)/n.$
Substituting in the formula, the result is $p^2/(p^2+(1-p)^2/(n-1)).$
Note that $(1-p)/(n-1)$ is the probability that letter $a_i$ is printed given that impulse other than $i$ is selected.
$endgroup$
$begingroup$
In this case is it difficult to find P(A|B) directly using P(AB)/B? Also, I'm unclear on P(B|not A). It seems that P(B intersect not A) would be (1-p)^2 so the result would be (1-p)^2n/(n-1).
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 2 at 21:16
$begingroup$
Try thinking in terms of conditional probabilities as specified in the Bayes formula. These conditionals are simpler to compute as shown above. $P(B|notA) = (1-p)^2/(n-1)^2$ is the probability that letter $a_i$ is printed twice given that impulse other than 𝑖 is selected.
$endgroup$
– dnqxt
Apr 2 at 21:37
$begingroup$
That makes sense intuitively, but I was thinking of $P(B|not A) = P(B not A)/P(not A) = (1-p)^2/((n-1)/n)) = (1-p)^2n/(n-1)$. Why does this approach differ by an extra n?
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 3 at 0:12
$begingroup$
Event $(B|notA)$ consists of two independent events, $(B_1|not A) =$ "$a_i$ is the first letter printed given that impulse $i$ is not selected" and $(B_2|not A)=$ "$a_i$ is the second letter printed given that impulse $i$ is not selected". $Pr(B|not A)=Pr(B_1| not A)Pr(B_2 |not A)$, where $Pr(B_1| not A)=Pr(B_2| not A)= (1-p)/(n-1)$.
$endgroup$
– dnqxt
Apr 3 at 1:23
$begingroup$
Is there any difference in this case between $P(B|not A)$ and $P(B cap not A)$?
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 3 at 19:55
|
show 1 more comment
$begingroup$
Let $A$ be the event that impulse $i$ is chosen and $B$ the event that the first and the second printed letter is $a_i$.
Use Bayes theorem to obtain the desired probability.
$$
P(A|B) = fracA)P(A)notA)P(notA)
$$
Now, $P(A) = 1/n, P(B|A) = p^2, P(B|notA)=((1-p)/(n-1))^2, P(notA)=(n-1)/n.$
Substituting in the formula, the result is $p^2/(p^2+(1-p)^2/(n-1)).$
Note that $(1-p)/(n-1)$ is the probability that letter $a_i$ is printed given that impulse other than $i$ is selected.
$endgroup$
Let $A$ be the event that impulse $i$ is chosen and $B$ the event that the first and the second printed letter is $a_i$.
Use Bayes theorem to obtain the desired probability.
$$
P(A|B) = fracA)P(A)notA)P(notA)
$$
Now, $P(A) = 1/n, P(B|A) = p^2, P(B|notA)=((1-p)/(n-1))^2, P(notA)=(n-1)/n.$
Substituting in the formula, the result is $p^2/(p^2+(1-p)^2/(n-1)).$
Note that $(1-p)/(n-1)$ is the probability that letter $a_i$ is printed given that impulse other than $i$ is selected.
edited Apr 2 at 18:41
answered Apr 2 at 18:34
dnqxtdnqxt
8125
8125
$begingroup$
In this case is it difficult to find P(A|B) directly using P(AB)/B? Also, I'm unclear on P(B|not A). It seems that P(B intersect not A) would be (1-p)^2 so the result would be (1-p)^2n/(n-1).
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 2 at 21:16
$begingroup$
Try thinking in terms of conditional probabilities as specified in the Bayes formula. These conditionals are simpler to compute as shown above. $P(B|notA) = (1-p)^2/(n-1)^2$ is the probability that letter $a_i$ is printed twice given that impulse other than 𝑖 is selected.
$endgroup$
– dnqxt
Apr 2 at 21:37
$begingroup$
That makes sense intuitively, but I was thinking of $P(B|not A) = P(B not A)/P(not A) = (1-p)^2/((n-1)/n)) = (1-p)^2n/(n-1)$. Why does this approach differ by an extra n?
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 3 at 0:12
$begingroup$
Event $(B|notA)$ consists of two independent events, $(B_1|not A) =$ "$a_i$ is the first letter printed given that impulse $i$ is not selected" and $(B_2|not A)=$ "$a_i$ is the second letter printed given that impulse $i$ is not selected". $Pr(B|not A)=Pr(B_1| not A)Pr(B_2 |not A)$, where $Pr(B_1| not A)=Pr(B_2| not A)= (1-p)/(n-1)$.
$endgroup$
– dnqxt
Apr 3 at 1:23
$begingroup$
Is there any difference in this case between $P(B|not A)$ and $P(B cap not A)$?
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 3 at 19:55
|
show 1 more comment
$begingroup$
In this case is it difficult to find P(A|B) directly using P(AB)/B? Also, I'm unclear on P(B|not A). It seems that P(B intersect not A) would be (1-p)^2 so the result would be (1-p)^2n/(n-1).
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 2 at 21:16
$begingroup$
Try thinking in terms of conditional probabilities as specified in the Bayes formula. These conditionals are simpler to compute as shown above. $P(B|notA) = (1-p)^2/(n-1)^2$ is the probability that letter $a_i$ is printed twice given that impulse other than 𝑖 is selected.
$endgroup$
– dnqxt
Apr 2 at 21:37
$begingroup$
That makes sense intuitively, but I was thinking of $P(B|not A) = P(B not A)/P(not A) = (1-p)^2/((n-1)/n)) = (1-p)^2n/(n-1)$. Why does this approach differ by an extra n?
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 3 at 0:12
$begingroup$
Event $(B|notA)$ consists of two independent events, $(B_1|not A) =$ "$a_i$ is the first letter printed given that impulse $i$ is not selected" and $(B_2|not A)=$ "$a_i$ is the second letter printed given that impulse $i$ is not selected". $Pr(B|not A)=Pr(B_1| not A)Pr(B_2 |not A)$, where $Pr(B_1| not A)=Pr(B_2| not A)= (1-p)/(n-1)$.
$endgroup$
– dnqxt
Apr 3 at 1:23
$begingroup$
Is there any difference in this case between $P(B|not A)$ and $P(B cap not A)$?
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 3 at 19:55
$begingroup$
In this case is it difficult to find P(A|B) directly using P(AB)/B? Also, I'm unclear on P(B|not A). It seems that P(B intersect not A) would be (1-p)^2 so the result would be (1-p)^2n/(n-1).
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 2 at 21:16
$begingroup$
In this case is it difficult to find P(A|B) directly using P(AB)/B? Also, I'm unclear on P(B|not A). It seems that P(B intersect not A) would be (1-p)^2 so the result would be (1-p)^2n/(n-1).
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 2 at 21:16
$begingroup$
Try thinking in terms of conditional probabilities as specified in the Bayes formula. These conditionals are simpler to compute as shown above. $P(B|notA) = (1-p)^2/(n-1)^2$ is the probability that letter $a_i$ is printed twice given that impulse other than 𝑖 is selected.
$endgroup$
– dnqxt
Apr 2 at 21:37
$begingroup$
Try thinking in terms of conditional probabilities as specified in the Bayes formula. These conditionals are simpler to compute as shown above. $P(B|notA) = (1-p)^2/(n-1)^2$ is the probability that letter $a_i$ is printed twice given that impulse other than 𝑖 is selected.
$endgroup$
– dnqxt
Apr 2 at 21:37
$begingroup$
That makes sense intuitively, but I was thinking of $P(B|not A) = P(B not A)/P(not A) = (1-p)^2/((n-1)/n)) = (1-p)^2n/(n-1)$. Why does this approach differ by an extra n?
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 3 at 0:12
$begingroup$
That makes sense intuitively, but I was thinking of $P(B|not A) = P(B not A)/P(not A) = (1-p)^2/((n-1)/n)) = (1-p)^2n/(n-1)$. Why does this approach differ by an extra n?
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 3 at 0:12
$begingroup$
Event $(B|notA)$ consists of two independent events, $(B_1|not A) =$ "$a_i$ is the first letter printed given that impulse $i$ is not selected" and $(B_2|not A)=$ "$a_i$ is the second letter printed given that impulse $i$ is not selected". $Pr(B|not A)=Pr(B_1| not A)Pr(B_2 |not A)$, where $Pr(B_1| not A)=Pr(B_2| not A)= (1-p)/(n-1)$.
$endgroup$
– dnqxt
Apr 3 at 1:23
$begingroup$
Event $(B|notA)$ consists of two independent events, $(B_1|not A) =$ "$a_i$ is the first letter printed given that impulse $i$ is not selected" and $(B_2|not A)=$ "$a_i$ is the second letter printed given that impulse $i$ is not selected". $Pr(B|not A)=Pr(B_1| not A)Pr(B_2 |not A)$, where $Pr(B_1| not A)=Pr(B_2| not A)= (1-p)/(n-1)$.
$endgroup$
– dnqxt
Apr 3 at 1:23
$begingroup$
Is there any difference in this case between $P(B|not A)$ and $P(B cap not A)$?
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 3 at 19:55
$begingroup$
Is there any difference in this case between $P(B|not A)$ and $P(B cap not A)$?
$endgroup$
– Vahan
Apr 3 at 19:55
|
show 1 more comment
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Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown